Open Coffee Entrepreneur Group » GUI

PHP w/templates, MySQL, clean Web 2.0/AJAX interface design

Ronny Ager-Wick — Wed, 29 Apr 2009 16:10:00 +0000

John,
I can see you've decided not to be burned more times then 
Maybe one of the problems you face is because you specify the technology
to use up front. Of course if you already have an existing system, this
may make sense. To get to use the real hackers, the best developers
basically, you should let them decide the technology (except if they
suggest .net of course, which is a sign they're not really hackers
anyway :-b ). Although lots of great systems has been build using PHP up
though the years, a lot of the best developers has become "fed up" with
it, especially as so many wannabe developers that are only in it for the
money (the type of people that normally only use proprietary
technologies) has flooded the marketplace, making it difficult for
entrepreneurs like yourself to spot the really good ones.
When I recruit sub contractors I use my own experience as a developer
and software architect for more than a decade to evaluate whether
they're any good. It's still not a fool proof method, but the chances
for a hacker to find another hacker will always be much higher than a
non-hacker finding one - it takes one to know one.
(OK, I admit that doesn't help you much - you don't have a hacker, but
you need one to get one...)
As mentioned in an earlier thread, you want a hacker because they a
really good one is generally 10x more productive than an average one.
You might have to pay more, but you certainly get more as well. But be
careful, you can't just use the price as a guide to how good they are.
I've had absolutely amazing developers charging average rates and I've
seen completely useless ones charge sky-high rates. YMMV, basically.
I can't recommend myself, because I stopped using PHP ages ago, and I am
mostly involved on a higher level, managing the process, designing
complex database structures and making sure everyone understand each
other. Also, most of the devs I normally work with are overseas, and you
wanted UK based ones. I have to say most of my clients also prefer UK
based people, but given the choice between an average developer here and
a real hacker overseas, the choice is easy.
Just my 2¢, hopefully you can extract some useful information out of it 
Ronny.

For the record:
hacker = *really* good software developer, who doesn't have to have
prior knowledge about something in order to achieve something useful in
a minimum amount of time - they'll just do it, learn as they go along
cracker = bad hacker (the ones that hack CIA, etc)

a cracker is usually also a hacker but a hacker is not necessarily (or
rarely) a cracker.

John Hamlen wrote:
> Dear Fellow Entrepreneurs,
>
> Does anyone have a developer/company they are dying to recommend with expertise described in the subject line?
>
> I have a project that won't be a simple, hack-some-existing-code type affair. It will include elements such as interfacing to an SMS gateway.
>
> I've got my fingers burned a couple of times going through Elance, so I'd much rather rely on a personal recommendation than Elance feedback and uploaded examples of their work.
>
> Any recommendations much appreciated! UK based guys/girls preferred.
>
> Many thanks in advance,
> John
>
>
>
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help with company shares/equity

Carola Derpsch — Wed, 29 Apr 2009 03:32:00 +0000

Great, thank you all for the help. It has open some new areas to explore.

All the best,

Carola

2009/4/25 Stony Grunow <[address removed]>

If you have the time, I would suggest reading The Partnership Charter (first 30-odd pages available on Amazon for free). It walks you through how to make a non-binding agreement that guides your business partnership (share-based or partner-based, it's effectively a partnership till you go public).

The partnership charter tries to have you ask questions that would never / could never be addressed in your articles of association, like what to do if someone wants to hire a relative or spouse, or under what scenarios you would take on another co-owner, etc.

It won't help you if it comes to a legal fight, god-forbid, but setting this down, ahead of time, might help negate any potential conflicts.

stony
citrusconsultants.com

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Technical Alchemist
Cosma Consulting Ltd
United Kingdom
www.cosma.co.uk
www.twitter.com/cderpsch

+44 (0) 7883.079283

Should we store all the Q&A's + content we talk about?

Meriem — Tue, 28 Apr 2009 21:56:00 +0000

Hi Geoff,

Great idea! With this in mind, we introduced a wiki sections on Smarta.com under each of our 'bitesize' advice guides and have started populating them with all the great tips being shared on this forum and others. Our aim is to build a comprehensive, mostly user-generated resource which supplements the editorial advice & video entrepreneurs interviews.

The other feature we've introduced is a Q&A section – same principle as this meetup forum but not as advanced in terms of functionality just yet - this is definitely something we will be developing in the next few months. We've also partnered with a legal firm to provide free legal advice as part of this Q&A.

It's early days (we're 3 months old today) and we're still improving the depth and quality of the content, as well as the functionality of the site. We would really welcome your feedback in terms of how we can make the platform as useful as possible to you in the context of this conversation. So if you have any thoughts on this, we'd love to hear them.

Lastly and on a different note, we've got a few startups contributing 'video diaries' (the idea is to share your experiences of the week with other startups). So if anyone is interested in taking part, please get in touch. A good example video from CityAmigo here: http://www.smarta.com/inspiration/video-diaries (the rest can be found here: http://www.smarta.com/inspiration/video-diaries).

Cheers,

Meriem

www.smarta.com

2009/4/28 Geoff Wright <[address removed]>

Hey all,

Not sure if this has already been mentioned, or if anyone can be bothered – but I think its a good idea.

Phillip mentioned a similar concept in a previous mail, where he's collated a list of the best places to find icons, as suggested by this list (http://snagsta.com/people/phillip-hofmeyr/lists/where-to-find-website-icons5264)

I read most mails that come through this list, and I've seen an outrageous amount of invaluable content recommended: videos, podcasts, angel investor networks, funds, events, blogs, sites etc.

So, the question I ask is, do we think it might be a good idea to collate all this in some sort of searchable area? Might not be a wiki, but I'm going to have a look anyway.

It'd have to be a crowd sourced [buzz buzz] effort.

Geoff

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How can we test a developer's skills?

Dan — Mon, 27 Apr 2009 20:57:00 +0000

Interesting experience Mohammed.

I've also found syntactical questions on paper are not very useful. After all, when is a developer going to write an entire program outside of an IDE? Syntax documentation is a few clicks away, but an excellent developer likely works with a basket of languages underpinned by competant problem-solving skills.

A paper test of pseudocode plus general problem-solving abilities is revealing. If a developer struggles with abstract problems then the quality of their practical coding ability is called into question.

Some famous examples from the past here: http://money.cnn.com/2007/08/29/technology/brain_teasers.biz2/index.htm.

Dan

2009/4/27 Mohammed Seedat <[address removed]>

Hi all I've been watching this thread and I thought I'd give my experience from the other side:

I recently had 2 interviews of which 1 I got the job and the other I am sure I didn't (I wasn't told because I'd already accepted this one).

For the job I didn't get (I assume): A new web startup company complete with Guitar Hero in their small office. Interviewed by 3 guys – founder, tech guy and another. I was asked questions relating to the job in terms of business and marketing and then given a short paper test by the tech guy. It was very simple but for some reason I froze and couldn't write a very very simple program nor identify the output from an even simpler programming without looking incompetent. I answered his SQL questions but it seemed like
he was testing my memory ability rather than by general SQL knowledge (it's easy to forget the general order of syntax when you're not working in front of a text editor or a GUI!). For some reason this interview made me feel rather stupid and not very good at what I do.

For the job I did get: Again a new web startup company complete with funky flooring. I had 2 interviews. First with 2 ladies who were not technical. This was a complete barrel of laughs and I felt comfortable with them and they with me. The second interview was an hour long "discussion" with a developer who was assigned the task of establishing my identity. In both this technical interview and my failed technical interview the interviewer was in their late 20's with similar backgrounds and speaking styles. However I as a developer felt much more comfortable with this chap and his "discussion" approach. We covered many technical concepts and likes/dislikes. I
didn't have to prove I could write code because my past projects already established my competency. The interview culminated in a discussion about spell check implementations and speed issues so it wasn't as lightweight as you might imagine.

I've experienced many different interviewing styles over the years from being interviewed by a camcorder and an anonymous man to more friendly "chat" type interviews. The differences are stark and ultimately I believe the kind of people that usually get through the net are the one's that reflect the behaviour and attitudes of that particular interviewer on that day. It all seems a bit pot luck for both the interviewer and interviewee!

From: Tim
Hawkins <[address removed]>
To: [address removed]
Sent: Monday, 27 April, 2009 13:18:07
Subject: Re: [entrepreneur-1056] How can we test a developer's skills?

when interviewing engineers and developers i tend to use the following rules of thumb.

1. pose questions that show wether somebody is knowledgeable or deductive, knowledgeable people often appear to be very good, but are often not adaptable. you want deductive programmers.

2. Im more interested not in what people know, but in how they fill in the gaps in their knowledge. a good engineer knows how to use resources, books, internet, open source etc to find a problem solution that they may not know.

3. Look for generalists, people
who write code that solves classes of problems, not specific problems.

4. look for people who show enthusiasm for the application, if they dont get turned on by your application then its just working for money, and they are unlikely to go the extra mile.

5. dont be too driven by qualifications, most of the really good people i have worked with have been self taught, and motivated to keep current, see 4 above.

6. look for people who will ask for help when they need it, there is nothing worse than an engineer that grapples with a problem for days when a simple question would clear it up.

7. ask them to describe the most elegant thing they have seen, and tell you why it was elegant.

For the reasons above, im not really keen on mechanical testing of skills, you need to just chat to the candidate and get a feel
for their approach to things.

On 27 Apr 2009, at 13:00, iqbalgandham wrote:

Hi

Its actually not that hard, aside from there fitting into your overall company culture, which is something you can deduce yourself. What I always do (if I can meet the person face to face) is to give them a pen and a piece of paper, and then get them to write me 3 programs

1. A simple one which asks them to open, red, write etc from/to a file
2. Something which asks them to pull info or insert into a database
3. Something a little more advanced which asks them to carry out a calculation, i.e count the number of primes between 1-1000 etc etc

The key is the pen and paper, you will be surprised how many coders cannot do it with pen and paper, since they like to
code, run it, see if it works, then try again and again. If a coder can do it on paper, they will be on a diff level to most you will meet.

Also note, that you do not want to make the questions too difficult, since what you need coding will usually come down to working with a DB, inserting, deleting etc etc.

Also check out

http://www.techinterviews.com/perl-interview-questions-and-answers

they have segments for each language, and OS,
This is MS interview questions, they deal with OS, algos etc

http://halcyon.usc.edu/~kiran/msqs.html

Here are a few from google, MS , amazon etc

http://placementsindia.blogspot.com/

Also note, when stuck between two coders, who are equally as good, get them to
a) Write a paragraph of text explaining what they did last summer on holiday
b) Create a 3 slide ppt, showing what they do at work

Why? because whenever you are stuck between two people, the one who can write things down, and present them clearly and coherently and concisely wins

Iqbal Gandham
L: www.iqbalgandham.com/in/iqbalgandham
W: www.iqbalgandham.com
T: @iqbalgandham
S: feelin_tired

From: Tom Watts <[address removed]>
To: [address removed]
Sent: Monday, 27 April, 2009 11:55:03
Subject: [entrepreneur-1056] How can we test a developer's skills?

Hi everyone.

Long time listener, first time caller.

I was hoping that someone on this group could offer some advice…

We're in the business of building and running online communities for research and innovation, which we deliver to brands and agencys. Part of our proposition is the
delivery of our bespoke social network tool.

To date, we have been working with an external agency, who have done a good job at building our product to specification. However, as business ramps up, we are looking to refine the product and introduce new features and services. As such, it has become necessary to recruit a developer, who is versed in the use open source tools (LAMP).

We've looked around and have a good final list of candidates, who we feel could be a good 'fit' to our existing team.

The one area that we have yet to test for is the ability to actually code – including their approach to coding. Not having these skills internally, it is difficult for us to achieve this. As such we were hoping to find some form of test that we could give them.

In my mind, I thinking of a simple 1-2 hour exercise, whereby the candidates could make a simple web application/service/feature, which would demonstrate their skills. We
have a friendly developer who could then look through what they have made and give us an idea of their abilities.

Is there such a test that people know of? If not, perhaps there is a different approach that someone has used successfully?

Either way, I would very much appreciate any ideas people may have.

Thanks in advance

Tom
–
Tom Watts
Director

w: dubstudios.com
t: +44 (0) 20 8123 3452
m: +44 (0) 7791 163 866
skype: tomwatts22

dub I Communities for Insight & Innovation

Youmeus Ltd t/a Dub Studios is registered in England and Wales, Registration No: 6167745 and registered at The Pines, Boars Head, Crowborough, East Sussex. TN6 3HD

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How can we test a developer's skills?

Mohammed Seedat — Mon, 27 Apr 2009 20:38:00 +0000

Hi all I’ve been watching this thread and I thought I’d give my experience from the other side:

I recently had 2 interviews of which 1 I got the job and the other I am sure I didn’t (I wasn’t told because I’d already accepted this one).

For the job I didn’t get (I assume): A new web startup company complete with Guitar Hero in their small office. Interviewed by 3 guys – founder, tech guy and another. I was asked questions relating to the job in terms of business and marketing and then given a short paper test by the tech guy. It was very simple but for some reason I froze and couldn’t write a very very simple program nor identify the output from an even simpler programming without looking incompetent. I answered his SQL questions but it seemed like
he was testing my memory ability rather than by general SQL knowledge (it’s easy to forget the general order of syntax when you’re not working in front of a text editor or a GUI!). For some reason this interview made me feel rather stupid and not very good at what I do.

For the job I did get: Again a new web startup company complete with funky flooring. I had 2 interviews. First with 2 ladies who were not technical. This was a complete barrel of laughs and I felt comfortable with them and they with me. The second interview was an hour long “discussion” with a developer who was assigned the task of establishing my identity. In both this technical interview and my failed technical interview the interviewer was in their late 20’s with similar backgrounds and speaking styles. However I as a developer felt much more comfortable with this chap and his “discussion” approach. We covered many technical concepts and likes/dislikes. I
didn’t have to prove I could write code because my past projects already established my competency. The interview culminated in a discussion about spell check implementations and speed issues so it wasn’t as lightweight as you might imagine.

I’ve experienced many different interviewing styles over the years from being interviewed by a camcorder and an anonymous man to more friendly “chat” type interviews. The differences are stark and ultimately I believe the kind of people that usually get through the net are the one’s that reflect the behaviour and attitudes of that particular interviewer on that day. It all seems a bit pot luck for both the interviewer and interviewee!

From: Tim
Hawkins <[address removed]>
To: [address removed]
Sent: Monday, 27 April, 2009 13:18:07
Subject: Re: [entrepreneur-1056] How can we test a developer’s skills?

when interviewing engineers and developers i tend to use the following rules of thumb.

1. pose questions that show wether somebody is knowledgeable or deductive, knowledgeable people often appear to be very good, but are often not adaptable. you want deductive programmers.

2. Im more interested not in what people know, but in how they fill in the gaps in their knowledge. a good engineer knows how to use resources, books, internet, open source etc to find a problem solution that they may not know.

3. Look for generalists, people
who write code that solves classes of problems, not specific problems.

4. look for people who show enthusiasm for the application, if they dont get turned on by your application then its just working for money, and they are unlikely to go the extra mile.

5. dont be too driven by qualifications, most of the really good people i have worked with have been self taught, and motivated to keep current, see 4 above.

6. look for people who will ask for help when they need it, there is nothing worse than an engineer that grapples with a problem for days when a simple question would clear it up.

7. ask them to describe the most elegant thing they have seen, and tell you why it was elegant.

For the reasons above, im not really keen on mechanical testing of skills, you need to just chat to the candidate and get a feel
for their approach to things.

On 27 Apr 2009, at 13:00, iqbalgandham wrote:

Hi

Its actually not that hard, aside from there fitting into your overall company culture, which is something you can deduce yourself. What I always do (if I can meet the person face to face) is to give them a pen and a piece of paper, and then get them to write me 3 programs

1. A simple one which asks them to open, red, write etc from/to a file
2. Something which asks them to pull info or insert into a database
3. Something a little more advanced which asks them to carry out a calculation, i.e count the number of primes between 1-1000 etc etc

The key is the pen and paper, you will be surprised how many coders cannot do it with pen and paper, since they like to
code, run it, see if it works, then try again and again. If a coder can do it on paper, they will be on a diff level to most you will meet.

Also note, that you do not want to make the questions too difficult, since what you need coding will usually come down to working with a DB, inserting, deleting etc etc.

Also check out

http://www.techinterviews.com/perl-interview-questions-and-answers

they have segments for each language, and OS,
This is MS interview questions, they deal with OS, algos etc

http://halcyon.usc.edu/~kiran/msqs.html

Here are a few from google, MS , amazon etc

href="http://placementsindia.blogspot.com/">http://placementsindia.blogspot.com/

Also note, when stuck between two coders, who are equally as good, get them to
a) Write a paragraph of text explaining what they did last summer on holiday
b) Create a 3 slide ppt, showing what they do at work

Why? because whenever you are stuck between two people, the one who can write things down, and present them clearly and coherently and concisely wins

Iqbal Gandham
L: www.iqbalgandham.com/in/iqbalgandham
W: www.iqbalgandham.com
T: @iqbalgandham
S: feelin_tired

face="Tahoma" size="2">

From: Tom Watts <[address removed]>
To: [address removed]
Sent: Monday, 27 April, 2009 11:55:03
Subject: [entrepreneur-1056] How can we test a developer’s skills?

Hi everyone.

Long time listener, first time caller.

I was hoping that someone on this group could offer some advice…

We’re in the business of building and running online communities for research and innovation, which we deliver to brands and agencys. Part of our proposition is the
delivery of our bespoke social network tool.

To date, we have been working with an external agency, who have done a good job at building our product to specification. However, as business ramps up, we are looking to refine the product and introduce new features and services. As such, it has become necessary to recruit a developer, who is versed in the use open source tools (LAMP).

We’ve looked around and have a good final list of candidates, who we feel could be a good ‘fit’ to our existing team.

The one area that we have yet to test for is the ability to actually code – including their approach to coding. Not having these skills internally, it is difficult for us to achieve this. As such we were hoping to find some form of test that we could give them.

In my mind, I thinking of a simple 1-2 hour exercise, whereby the candidates could make a simple web application/service/feature, which would demonstrate their skills. We
have a friendly developer who could then look through what they have made and give us an idea of their abilities.

Is there such a test that people know of? If not, perhaps there is a different approach that someone has used successfully?

Either way, I would very much appreciate any ideas people may have.

Thanks in advance

Tom
–
Tom Watts
Director

w: dubstudios.com
t: +44 (0) 20 8123 3452
m: +44 (0) 7791 163 866
skype: tomwatts22

dub I Communities for Insight & Innovation

Youmeus Ltd t/a Dub Studios is registered in England and Wales, Registration No: 6167745 and registered at The Pines, Boars Head, Crowborough, East Sussex. TN6 3HD

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help with company shares/equity

Stony Grunow — Sat, 25 Apr 2009 09:35:00 +0000

If you have the time, I would suggest reading The Partnership Charter (first 30-odd pages available on Amazon for free). It walks you through how to make a non-binding agreement that guides your business partnership (share-based or partner-based, it's effectively a partnership till you go public).

The partnership charter tries to have you ask questions that would never / could never be addressed in your articles of association, like what to do if someone wants to hire a relative or spouse, or under what scenarios you would take on another co-owner, etc.

It won't help you if it comes to a legal fight, god-forbid, but setting this down, ahead of time, might help negate any potential conflicts.

stony
citrusconsultants.com

Business advice

Joyanta — Wed, 22 Apr 2009 22:27:00 +0000

Funny that I am just creating a profile there.
Thanks,

Joyanta
2009/4/22 Smarta <[address removed]>:

> Check out www.smarta.com

> I think it'll really help you

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>

> Farleigh

>

> Farleigh Hungerford

> Editorial Intern

>

> Follow me on Twitter: @smartaHQ

>

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Business advice

Farleigh Hungerford — Wed, 22 Apr 2009 22:17:00 +0000

Check out www.smarta.com

I think it’ll really help you

Smarta.com is a business support and advice network for
small business owners and entrepreneurs. Access real business advice from
established entrepreneurs and network with other people starting and running
their business. Practical business guides, news, features, tools, video
interviews with top entrepreneurs, wikis, live Q&A and free professional
legal advice make Smarta the one-to-stop-shop for anyone seeking reliable,
real-time business advice

Farleigh

Farleigh Hungerford

Editorial Intern

Follow me on Twitter: @smartaHQ

T: 020 7631 4003 F : 020 7580 9768 M: 07884 490 522 A: 33-34 Alfred Place, London WC1E 7DP www.smarta.com

Smarta.com is the brand name of Smarta Enterprises Ltd, a Company incorporated in England and Wales, No. 006643570.

The information in this email is confidential and may be legally privileged. The contents may not be disclosed or used by anyone other than the addressee. If you are not the intended recipient, any disclosure, copying, distribution or any action taken or omitted to be taken in reliance on it, is prohibited and may be unlawful. Smarta Enterprises Ltd cannot accept responsibility for the accuracy or completeness of this email as it has been transmitted over a public network. If you suspect that the email may have been intercepted or amended, please contact the sender.

99designs.com – feedback

user 9349062 — Wed, 15 Apr 2009 21:30:00 +0000

Hi Robert,

I’m based in North London. I’d love to have a chat about your project. I’ll be at the open coffee meet tomorrow and you can email me directly at [address removed]

Many thanks

Doug

Doug Lyon

[address removed]

www.mashinteractive.com

On 15 Apr 2009, at 14:12, Robert wrote:

Hi Doug

I’m interested in your concept and also the context of the framework within which you are offering your service. I’m reaching the point of development of a project whereby I’ll need to instruct the services of a graphic designer. So far I’ve received 2 quotes for the work, one is a professional contact the other is someone I know who is prepared to be more flexible on price. My thoughts are to use the professional contact as this sets in place for me the structure within which we will both be operating. I’ll be the client and will have the final say in the format of the presentation. The relationship is understood by both of us and there are no woolly areas, no obligation from either side to operate in a certain way, no sense of debt or favours being owed.

However, due to the nature of the project, I’m still interested in your concept and I’m wondering whether it might be worth having a chat. I’m situated below Guildford. Where abouts are you?

Regards,

Robert

99designs.com – feedback

Robert — Wed, 15 Apr 2009 21:12:00 +0000

color=#0000ff size=2>Hi Doug

color=#0000ff size=2>

color=#0000ff size=2>I’m interested in your concept and also the context of the
framework within which you are offering your service. I’m reaching the point of
development of a project whereby I’ll need to instruct the services of a graphic
designer. So far I’ve received 2 quotes for the work, one is a professional
contact the other is someone I know who is prepared to be more flexible on
price. My thoughts are to use the professional contact as this sets in place for
me the structure within which we will both be operating. I’ll be the
client and will have the final say in the format of the presentation. The
relationship is understood by both of us and there are no woolly areas, no
obligation from either side to operate in a certain way, no sense of debt
or favours being owed.

color=#0000ff size=2>

color=#0000ff size=2>However, due to the nature of the project, I’m still
interested in your concept and I’m wondering whether it might be worth having a
chat. I’m situated below Guildford. Where abouts are
you?

color=#0000ff size=2>

color=#0000ff size=2>Regards,

color=#0000ff size=2>

color=#0000ff size=2>Robert

color=#0000ff size=2>

From: [address removed]
[mailto:[address removed]] On Behalf Of Doug
Lyon
Sent: 15 April 2009 11:18
To:
[address removed]
Subject: Re: [entrepreneur-1056]
99designs.com – feedback

Hi Ronnny thanks for your response.
my initial client base are companies or individuals that are base in or near to
london.

I want to meet them face to face,
it?s a good way to start a relationship and I get to fully understand the scope
and the objectives of their project and can better gauge whether I can help make
a positive difference to their business. (There will be exceptions to this,
where we have developed a relationship online)

I will hopefully also be able to
gauge whether they aim to take advantage of Mash?s offer and not pay anything.
And this might happen , it is a risk, but by focusing on their real need,
doing the best job for them, agreeing a time frame, we are both happy with,
having an idea of what they want to pay before we start, developing the
relationship and playing a real part in getting their business off the ground
from a design perspective, I?m hoping this model will work.

Another point is that we get to work
with great people, exciting projects and opportunities and the work we do for
these companies is an advert for Mash?s design skills and services, where money
is not exchanged for our services, some people may offer their services in
return for ours.

The more people Mash work with and
pay a reasonable amount that pays our bills and keeps the ?experiment? going,
the more able Mash are able to help other people who initially can only pay a
nominal amount.

When the business model is not about
money but about great work and about what we can do for you rather than
how much money we can make out of you, I feel people will spread the word
through a feeling of ?Wow? that?s really helped me, how can I help
them?

A typical business person
has?

* 17 friends
/ colleagues they?re connected to

* 641 people in their
network

* 5196 topics their
network knows about or has a shared interest in

That?s potentially a great audience
and if this business model continues to work, I really feel it can make a
difference and make my girlfriend believe I?m not mad!

Thanks for taking the time to write
back!

I’ll be posting replies back with
increased regularity on here and also on my my blog at class=Apple-style-span style="FONT-FAMILY: Helvetica"> href="http://www.mashinteractive.com/blog.html">http://www.mashinteractive.com/blog.html

face=Helvetica>

face=Helvetica>Have a great day

style="FONT-FAMILY: Helvetica">

Doug Lyon

href="mailto:[address removed]">[address removed]

www.mashinteractive.com

On 15 Apr 2009, at 07:38, Ronny Ager-Wick wrote:

class=Apple-interchange-newline>

Doug, interesting business model. Reminds me about my favourite doctor/chiropractor/healer/medicine man in a far away barrio in the Philippines. After receiving their treatment, patients simply went to a corner of the room, where they, at their discretion, put money in a bowl. If you have nothing, you’re not expected to pay anything. If you are rich, you can still pay what other people normally pay, which is about 60-70p per treatment. Nobody steals from the bowl, that’s completely unheard of. He simply collects his money at the end of the day, and treats everybody with the same professionalism, no matter their payment ability. I doubt this is a very profitable business for him generally, but he’s more interested in helping people than maintaining his own personal wealth. He’s actually a really good doctor, with vast experience and a fantastic use of native medicine instead of commercial ones where possible, andthe result is that sometimes, after he has cured some rich people, he may suddenly receive major gifts out of the blue, sometimes anonymous. So it actually works in his case, but one important aspect is that the initial “donation” is made cash on delivery. Plus, he has something you don’t have – everyone he treats are local, or can be recognized somehow, so not paying their share would be shameful. Here in London, you’ll never achieve that effect. One thing that may become troublesome here in the UK though is that some people seem to use you as a bank, pushing out the payment date so long they forget what you did for them. Are you going to demand quick payment, of whatever amount they are willing to pay, or let them use you as their ow personal credit facility? Another potential problem is how much time you spend on each client. For example, if someone is planning on paying you £150, because that’s what they think it will cost on 99designs, and they don’t see the difference, should you spend as much time with them as the ones that are prepared to pay £3k?Do you agree the amount they pay up front?
Or are you prepared to give away work to unethical and rouge players? I’d love to hear how this goes, and I’m tempted to offer the same, and in some cases I have – to a degree, but I have expenses to pay, both fixed and variable, and I’m not sure if the UK market is ready for this business model. Good luck, though! ~Ronny. PS: I’m starting up a project now. Do you accept a £1 initial donation and a major contribution when the project has become successful? You see the problem, I’ve now pushed the risk over to you without feeling very guilty – because I will pay you, but it depends on the project’s success. Avoid becoming a bank, unless you have lots of money and are prepared to accept some defaults…
Doug Lyon wrote:

type="cite">Hi,

I’ve been following with interest the thread (and other related
ones) about 99 designs, free design templates and competitions etc,
some interesting points raised and i’d love to have your opinions on
this:

Throughout my career (and i’m sure i’m not alone!), as a designer up to
creative director for predominately London based design and
advertising agencies, I have tried to add value to all client relationships
and tried to always focus on the work & client business objectives
rather than the cost.

This has not always gone down too well with my bosses but my feeling
was that if we focused on the long-term value of the agency/client
relationship, helping our clients achieve their business objectives without
quoting £xxxx every time we moved a mouse, that this
approach would be recognised, leading to a stronger relationship
with our clients , where their success would be ours.

Similarly, outside of work, I have used my skills
and experience to help friends & family, from websites to
wedding invites!, In both cases being helpful and useful has
been worthwhile and rewarding.

In part due to the present economic climate, where people are losing
their job’s, budgets are being cut and money is limited, and in part due to
a belief that their may be a better way of working I have set up a
design agency with a difference.

Aimed initially at the start-up groups I’m involved
with, Mash interactive extends the notion of being useful,
helpful and focused on value rather than cost.

To this end, Mash does not charge for the work we do,
rather, we invite our clients to pay what they can afford or what they
believe the job is worth to their business, after the work
is satisfactorily completed. Simple as that, if our clients are
happy and successful, we feel we will be to!

The url is moz-do-not-send="true">www.mashinteractive.com and it should be pretty
self-explanatory what we do. I’d love to hear your thoughts, comments,
opinions, either on the blog or emailed here, many thanks in advance!

Kind regards

Doug

Doug Lyon

moz-do-not-send="true">[address removed]

moz-do-not-send="true">www.mashinteractive.com

On 6 Apr 2009, at 04:38, Larry wrote:
class=Apple-interchange-newline>

Hi,

Our designer anwered with

href="http://www.design.org.au/content.cfm?id=245"
moz-do-not-send="true">http://www.design.org.au/content.cfm?id=245

href="http://www.designcouncil.org.uk/en/About-Design/Research/The-Business-of-Design2/Winning-business/"
target=_blank
moz-do-not-send="true">http://www.designcouncil.org.uk/en/About-Design/Research/The-Business-of-Design2/Winning-business/ face=Arial color=navy size=2> style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: navy; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">
=
free pitching is not a solid method for a company.

Larry

On 4/3/09, Nick
Barker < moz-do-not-send="true">[address removed]> wrote:

style="PADDING-LEFT: 1ex; MARGIN: 0px 0px 0px 0.8ex; BORDER-LEFT: rgb(204,204,204) 1px solid">

Hi Jon/Harddeep

I’ve used both name="st">99Designs & Elance for logos – here are my
experiences, guidelines and advice on both:

href="http://nickpoint.co.uk/2009/01/28/using-99designs-sourcing-low-cost-logo-designs-part-2/"
target=_blank moz-do-not-send="true">Using name="st">99Designs: Sourcing low cost logo designs – PART
2
href="http://nickpoint.co.uk/2009/01/20/sourcing-low-cost-logo-designs-part-1/"
target=_blank moz-do-not-send="true">Sourcing low cost logo designs –
PART 1

Hope it helps

Best

Nick

On Fri, Apr 3, 2009 at 3:17 PM, Hardeep Rai dir=ltr>< moz-do-not-send="true">[address removed]> wrote:

style="PADDING-LEFT: 1ex; MARGIN: 0pt 0pt 0pt 0.8ex; BORDER-LEFT: rgb(204,204,204) 1px solid">

style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: rgb(0,0,0); FONT-FAMILY: Arial"> face=Arial color=#000000 size=2>

Hi Jon,

I have a good friend that has used href="http://www.99designs.com/" target=_blank
moz-do-not-send="true">www.99designs.com. When he showed me his
end product I could not believe he’d only paid US$300 for it ! It
was logo and a business card. Very impressive.

I think the way it works is that various freelancers read
your profile and then produce a mock up. You can then say what you
like / don’t like and they fine tune it until you get what you want.

I’ve not used it myself yet, but when I’m ready – I’ve always
thought that would be my first port of call….

What attracts me to it is that there are a number of people
pitching for your business. Needless to say – some of these will not
be any good – but some of them will be…

Thanks.

Hardeep.

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